What Boobs Are For--Part II

Happy New Year! (A little late.)

In my last post, Misty left a comment that I LOVED, but that also made me a little sad. She talked about how she normally nurses her youngest (nearly 3yo) at home now so that she doesn't have to deal with the judgements of others by nursing in public. I don't blame her at all. It just makes me sad that this is her reality. (A lot of women's reality, including mine.) This is exactly the subject I wanted to discuss in Part II. Not just nursing a toddler in public, but nursing ANY baby in public. Why is it so shunned? And why do I feel like it's possibly even more frowned-upon in the LDS society? (Not always the case, but I'll get into why I believe it to be so later.)

A few months back, I had a friend from AZ get kicked out of a McDonald's (yes, you read that right.....out of family-friendly Mickey-D's) for nursing her baby (who was less than a year old at the time....I believe he was around 6 months old). The McD's worker went so far as to "walk" them out to their cars (she was with another friend and their children), threatening to call the police! Nothing was done about it until the local news got involved and ran the story. I was shocked by the comments on the news website. There were a lot of supportive comments, but there were also a lot of hate-filled, ugly, disgusting comments as well. All because this woman decided to feed her child. And if you're thinking, "Well, she must have been showing a lot of skin," you're wrong. She does not like to expose herself, and therefore she keeps herself very well covered when nursing. In fact, I have yet to see ANY woman breastfeeding in public who is showing even a remotely offensive amount of skin. I see much more skin watching the teens walk through the mall in their skin tight clothes and shirts that leave nothing to the imagination. And yet nobody's kicking them out of McDonald's. Why is this?

I believe it's because our society is so hung up on the sexual nature of breasts that we've completely forgotten what their INTENDED purpose is. If you want to show cleavage down to your navel at an awards show, you make it onto the "Best Dressed" list. But if you dare show any of that skin with a baby attached to it, you're waging a war on modesty and decency! This is so demented!

When this happened to my friend, a nurse-in was held at the McDonald's a few days later, and we held a virtual nurse-in on Facebook. (Basically a page that you "liked" to show your support for nursing in public.) A "friend" left a comment on my feed about how that was taking things too far and "there's something to be said for modesty" and "What about the people who aren't in our same 'season' of life (ie those without kids or those whose kids are older)?" and "What about the possibility of a 13yo boy without any siblings or experience seeing a woman breastfeeding.....what about being sensitive to him?"

Honestly, I wanted to smack her. But I refrained and tried to show her my perspective. Nursing isn't about being modest or immodest. It's about feeding a baby. Is there a possibility that you might see a little bit of skin or (heaven forbid) nipple while watching someone nurse a baby? Yep. I'm sure that people who've been around me have seen more skin than I realize when I'm feeding my babies. But do I care? Absolutely not. My "friend" who thinks nursing in public is immodest would see that as being confrontational. But I disagree. I never purposely show skin, but I also don't freak out if I'm not as fast with my shirt as my baby is in turning her head. It happens. Has someone around me ever been uncomfortable by my nursing? Most likely. But as I said to my "friend," my responsibility lies in feeding my baby, not in making sure everyone around me is ok with me feeding my baby.

Also, you can't please everybody. Some people are offended by it no matter how many layers a woman puts over the "offending activity." I know a lot of women who choose to use a nursing cover. I've even given them out as gifts before because I think I would've been more comfortable using one when AJ was a baby. It took us a while to get the hang of things and more often than not I needed 2 hands to nurse her and it was nearly impossible to keep my boob covered up. So I used a blanket instead, which fell off constantly. So annoying. So I think those nursing covers are a great idea for anyone who's not super comfortable or is less-than-coordinated, as I was. But I don't use them now. I think I tried them with Tink, but by then I was a lot more comfortable (and coordinated) and didn't feel the need to use one. Plus I actually think they draw MORE attention to the "offending activity." It's no secret what's going on under one of those things. ;) What I worry about with the nursing covers is that women feel the need to use them for everybody else's benefit and that bothers me. If a woman is more comfortable, HERSELF, using one, then more power to her. But if she's doing it because that's what is politically correct in this society, then that makes me crazy.

I had a lengthy conversation with another great friend who didn't like breastfeeding pictures because she worried that it perpetuated the p*rn problem. I don't know whether it does or doesn't, but I do think this subject is at the root of one of my issues with the opposition of nursing in public. In today's society boys and men are taught that boobs are for one thing and one thing only AND that they're these great, mysterious balls of wonder put on women purely for male enjoyment. I think this is at the heart of why the p*rn industry is so huge right now (along with the plethora of ways it's available). If we take away the mystery and wonder with our young boys and teach them first and foremost the intended purpose of boobs and the rest of women's bodies, then HOPEFULLY they won't be so caught up in trying to get a glimpse of them.

It's one of the things I believe to be at the root of the p*rn problem within the church these days. Because boobs-in-the-act-of-breastfeeding are lumped together with boobs-in-general when discussing modesty, boobs have this mystery and secrecy behind them that would stir anybody's curiosity. I found out something recently that made me jump for joy. It hasn't always been this way within the church. Remember WAY back in the day.....I'm talking pioneer-times? When the women would be covered from neck to ankle? Well, that was true at all times EXCEPT when breastfeeding! Surprise! Because it was NORMAL back then. That's how you fed your baby. And it was completely acceptable and normal, EVEN during Sacrament Meeting. -gasp!- Want proof?

(photo courtesy of http://rixarixa.blogspot.com/)

This is a photo of a painting at the Church History Museum. You can see the full version here along with a couple other close-ups depicting breastfeeding in the early days of the church and a great blog post about it. I love it! Here's another great post about nursing in the church. (This post is another great read about exposing children to nursing.)

This shows me that it is a fairly recent development in our society for nursing to be considered "immodest" or something that needs to be taken to another room.

I was talking to my brother and sister-in-law about this last night and expressing my concern that maybe the LDS society was a little TOO modest (specifically within our homes) and if the human body wasn't such a mystery that only serves to pique the curiosity of young men and young women, that MAYBE we wouldn't have as big of a fight against porn as we currently do. My brother pointed out that there are societies that are more modest than we are. Muslims, for example, cover much more than we do when outside of the home. BUT I don't know that they are as modest INSIDE their homes. One of my good friends in MI was Muslim and she invited me to a few get-togethers with her friends and family. These were female get-togethers, but there were children present (male and female children). All the women took off their hijabs while inside and "got comfortable." During one of these parties, a number of the women did some belly dancing, and wore the associated clothing. This is the only example I have to go on since we don't have many Muslim neighbors here in UT. But it was interesting to me that, at least in the case of these women, their "modest" clothing was worn only when men were around. This showed me that their boys grew up seeing their mothers not-fully-clothed. Another question I had, which I don't know the answer to, is whether or not there is as much of a problem with pornography in the Muslim society as there is in the LDS society. So once again, lots of questions, which I don't have the answers to. I only have theories.

So maybe nursing in public (and around young children, especially) isn't the cure for p*rn, but I think it is probably a good defense. There will always be p*rn and there will always be men and women who struggle with it, but my hope (at least for my children) is that because they have been exposed to what *real* bodies look like and what their purpose is, they will be less likely to get caught up in the mystery surrounding them.

Poor Roo is kind of an on-going experiment. Being my one and only son, I guess it's safe to say I'm testing out my theory on him. I'm going to confess something that I may get berated for. But so-be-it. I'm not advocating this for everybody, but so far it's working for us. Brent and I decided long ago that we wouldn't hide our bodies from our children until 1 of us (either the kids or the parents) felt uncomfortable. So far, Brent has felt uncomfortable with AJ around, so she knows she can't be in the bathroom when he's getting in and out of the shower. I don't think AJ could care less. She was old enough when we stopped letting her in that I'm sure she remembers what his body looks like. And she's still seen Roo naked now and again, so it's not like she doesn't know what a penis looks like. (The younger 3 girls still all see me and Brent naked almost daily.) Many women would frown on the fact that Roo still sees me naked. But I am very comfortable with my body (I guess having 5 kids and multiple hands and faces in your nether region will do that to you). Not that I'd go stand out on my porch naked as a jaybird for all the neighbors to see, but I don't mind those who are close to me seeing me naked. Roo is not yet uncomfortable with this. I recently told a friend this and she was shocked because her 6yo son would be mortified to see her naked. He's into the "EW, girls! Cooties! Yuck!" thing. Roo hasn't ever gotten into that, most likely because he's homeschooled and has no idea that girls are supposed to be gross yet. None of his homeschool friends have told him otherwise and apparently neither have his church or neighborhood friends, since many of them ARE girls. ;)

I'm not sure how much longer this relationship will go on. I'm sure one of us will start to feel uncomfortable fairly soon. But for now, he still walks in on me while I'm getting dressed, and we have a conversation. The whole time I'm watching for signs of discomfort from him, but there haven't been any yet. He looks me in the face. His eyes don't wander, even though I know he's seeing my whole body. And he never gives any indication that this is anything but normal. It makes me happy. Because when he's bombarded by images of scantily-clad women and websites showing stars covering nipples and groins, he's going to know what's underneath those stars. And the FIRST image of a naked woman that is planted in his mind will be that of his mother (or some of the other women that we've watched on birth videos and such). NORMAL female bodies. And he's going to know that a vagina gives birth and that boobs feed babies. And that sometimes (most times) women's bodies don't look like they do on the magazines and that THAT'S OK. Because his father, who he looks up to and admires as his hero, LOVED this woman who had a less-than-magazine-image body. In fact, it had -gasp!- stretch marks from babies and it had -gasp!- pubic hair and it sometimes even had -gasp!- hairy legs! And those boobs that he'll eventually learn from society are purely sexual, he'll be able to remember his mother feeding all of his sisters and know that their most important purpose is for the nourishment of children.

This is my hope and my prayer, anyway. Like I said, Roo is kind of an on-going experiment. But it's one I believe in (duh, otherwise I wouldn't be doing it).

So this probably goes way deeper than just nursing in public. But I believe this is where it starts. One of my fears is that my last baby won't nurse until s/he is old enough to remember nursing. And then s/he won't see it on a daily basis like his/her siblings. And there won't be enough women around who go against the norms of society and dare to feed their babies in front of my children. Oh, how I want more women to give my children this opportunity -- to see someone besides their mother nursing a baby.

Now when I see a woman nursing in public (which is still a rare occasion, unfortunately), I go out of my way to give her a smile.

Here are a couple more great blogs about breastfeeding in public (2 of these are referenced above):

http://www.nursingfreedom.org/2010/08/why-children-should-witness.html

http://aworldofwisdom.blogspot.com/2010/08/should-children-be-exposed-to.html

http://rixarixa.blogspot.com/2010/08/breastfeeding-history-moment-lds.html

ps I have a friend who hates that I use the word "boobs." And I admit, it's not the prettiest word. But I don't love the word "breasts." Our children know that word, and know what they are, but we use "boobs" more in this house (not that we go around saying these words numerous times a day), so that's why I used that word in this post. Sorry for those that hate that word. Maybe I should have said "milk bags." :)

pps I should have made it more clear before, but just to make sure I'm understood.......I DO think boobs are for more than just breastfeeding. They most definitely serve a sexual purpose and I think this is as God intended. They are multi-functional, for sure. BUT I do believe their most important role (and the one that should NOT be hidden away) is that of baby nurturer.

What Boobs Are For-- Part I

I'm going to do a 2-part rant about breastfeeding. I'm doing it in 2 parts to (hopefully) keep it all readable lengths. Because I have a lot to say (as usual). Also, because I have 2 separate ideas I would like to discuss.

The first point I'd like to talk about is extended breastfeeding. It's been on my mind a lot lately since I have an 18 month old who still nurses a number of times a day. I'll start by telling you about an experience I had Saturday. I'm still not sure what to do about it. Maybe you can help me decide.

I was in desperate need of new nursing bras since the ones I was currently using were the same bras I bought when Lady was born and I've been using them consistently since then. They were also about 3 sizes too big and it was getting harder to hide the wrinkles under my shirts. After attempting to find some at JCPenney (they only had about 4 varieties and the ladies there weren't helpful AT ALL), Macy's and Dillard's (which don't even carry nursing bras-- which is discrimination, if you ask me), I was at a loss. Luckily my friend came over to do my hair a couple of weeks ago and told me about a local little shop that specializes in maternity/nursing wear. I was so happy! So I went there Saturday and fell in love as soon as I walked into the store. It was FULL of bras! I knew I'd be able to find something there. And even better than the amount of bras was the service I received from the sweet, little lady who was working there that day. We were the only 2 in the store and she helped me figure out the right size and helped me adjust each bra just right so I could really see/feel the differences. It was the best bra-shopping experience of my life!

Except for one detail.

When I first told the lady (we'll call her Lorraine) that I needed a nursing bra, she asked me how old my baby was. I told her, "18 months." She took a longer-than-necessary pause and then the conversation went like this:

Lorraine: "Oh." As if she didn't know what to do with that information. She then asked, "How long do you nurse your babies?"

Me: "I don't really have a set time limit. I'd like to continue however long my baby would like to."

Lorraine: "How long is the longest you've nursed?"

Me: "This is actually about when my last baby quit because I was pregnant with current-baby and my milk dried up and she didn't like that. But I'm not pregnant now and current-baby is still going strong!"

Lorraine: "Oh. Well, I had a friend whose daughter was old enough to actually ask for "chi chi." I just think that's too old. But that's just my opinion, of course."

Me (surprised at the direction this conversation is taking, and not quite sure how to handle it): "Well, it's just so good for them. And it doesn't stop being good for them just because they can ask for it."

Lorraine: "True."

Me: "It's certainly better than cow's milk."

(Which, if you think about it, is also breast milk, just from a bovine instead of a human. I'd much rather my baby be getting breastmilk from her own species, MEANT for her own species.)

Lorraine: "Hmm. Well, I know that in 3rd world countries, where they don't have a lot of food, they nurse their children until they're MUCH older than they do here. I guess it's just not kosher here."

Me: "Yeah, I envy those societies. They know what they're doing. That's what's natural."

Lorraine: "So, what do you think about that bra? It's a nice fit, isn't it?"

Thus ends the awkward conversation.

This is not the first time I have been questioned about my nursing practices, but it is the most lengthy questioning I've experienced. I was caught off-guard because I'd (wrongly) assumed that a woman who worked in a pro-breastfeeding job would actually have a little more knowledge than the average person who just takes the "norms" of society and aligns their thinking accordingly.

I am ashamed to admit, I actually used to think the same way as her. I might've even uttered similar words about not nursing "after they can ask for it".........before I became a mother.

The thing is, when you're in the middle of motherhood, nursing is just something you do everyday (and night). And there wasn't ever a time when I looked at my baby and thought, "Now you're too old to nurse." Each day, they were just one day older than yesterday. And what sense does that argument make anyway? Just because a child can ask for something, we shouldn't give it to them? What if they were asking for a bottle, or a glass of water? And some babies as small as 6 months old can sign for milk. Does that mean they should be cut off? It's just a silly, silly nonsense reason for weaning a child.

Some of my biggest regrets as a mother are the ending of my nursing relationships with each of my 3 oldest children. With AJ, I bottlefed along with breastfeeding because I was too scared to nurse in public, and also because I was in school still and wanted the reassurance that somebody else could feed my child. None of my children since her have ever had a bottle. We don't even own any now. AJ was 9 months old when she started getting all 4 of her top (middle) teeth at the same time. The bottle was easier for her, so she started refusing to nurse. NOW I understand that this was just a nursing strike and I could've pushed through it and continued our nursing relationship. I didn't know that back then, and I had no support to continue nursing. My mother had nursed each of her children for 6 months and thought that was plenty of time. (And in her defense, it was a LOT more time than most women were nursing in that era.)

With Roo, it was such a struggle to nurse him from the beginning. I saw a lactation consultant for 4 MONTHS! My nipples bled for the first 2 months because we could just not get his latch right. So I was not about to give up soon after. My goal was a year, and I made it there. At that point, Roo fell madly in love with food. Real food. And he lost interest in nursing. Again, I could've pushed through and kept the relationship going if I'd have realized it was so good and important. But I didn't.

With Tink, I mistakenly thought that I had to quit nursing to get pregnant again, even though my period had long since returned. So I weaned her at 15 months. She wasn't ready to quit. This is really one of my biggest regrets as a mother. Because it wasn't in any way Tink's choice. It was mine. I still mourn the loss of our nursing relationship.

Finally with Lady I knew better. I got pregnant while nursing, and about halfway through the pregnancy, my milk dried up. I would've kept going. I was actually looking forward to tandem-nursing. But Lady would have nothing to do with it. Our nursing relationship ended when she was 18 months old.

Recently, I've had a few people ask me how long I plan to nurse June. My answer is, "As long as it is beneficial for both of us." She still loves it and I still love it. Just yesterday she was being restless in Sacrament meeting and I whispered in her ear, asking her if she was excited for Nursery. Well, all she heard was "nurse" and got a huge smile on her face and immediately flopped herself back in my arms, ready to go. I laughed out loud, and then I nursed her. :)

Breastfeeding a toddler is very different than breastfeeding an infant. It has its pros and cons, just like anything else. But, in my opinion, the pros far outweigh the cons. I love the cuddle time. I love talking to her and knowing she understands what I'm saying. I love singing to her and seeing her smile while still trying to hold on to her latch. I love having something at my disposal that can immediately calm an agitated, sad, hurt, or frustrated toddler.

Did you know that breastmilk changes as the baby grows up? Toddler milk is quite different than infant milk. It has MUCH more fat in it. You know how doctors tell you children are supposed to drink whole cow's milk after they're a year old because of the high fat content? Well, guess what! Toddler breastmilk does the SAME THING, only it's actually made for the species that's drinking it.

So back to my experience with Lorraine. I'm unsure what to do about it, if anything. Part of me wants to write a letter, expressing my concern about the lack of support some new mothers might feel when talking to someone with these biases. Part of me wants to call her and talk to her over the phone. And part of me just wants to let it go, knowing I can't save the world. The trouble is, it's misinformation and opinions, based on cultural norms rather than biological/natural norms, that perpetuate the problem. As long as people who think like her keep walking around speaking their opinion, it's going to continue to be hard for new mothers to see past that and have the confidence to keep nursing their children. Ugh.

I feel like women today don't have the support they need to breastfeed in the first place, let alone breastfeed beyond a year. I was reading about another country, recently, (I believe it was the Netherlands, but I'm not certain and I can't find the link now) where they have a postpartum nurse/doula that comes to live with the mother for 2 weeks after birth (the Netherlands also have one of the highest rates of homebirth). She acts as a lactation consultant, and takes care of the new mother's every need. Why, oh why, don't we have anything like that here? There are some places where you can see a lactation consultant for free, but they are rare. And most new moms aren't particularly excited about leaving their house over and over to seek help. They have lactation consultants in the hospital, but in my experience, some are better than others. And there's the problem of them only seeing you once or twice during your stay. For me, I felt like I needed someone with me at each nursing session, to help me gain confidence and to just be there for moral support. I think things would've gone much smoother had I had that kind of support. And I think the number of breastfeeding women would increase if there was just some type of support system in place for new mothers. What is currently available is sadly lacking.

So leave me a comment and tell me what you think I should do in regards to Lorraine. I can't make up my mind.

And for anyone who'd like to read more about extended breastfeeding, there are lots of support groups, including La Leche League. Here are a few more good blog posts I've found:

http://compulsivewriter.com/?p=162

http://www.breastfeedingmomsunite.com/2009/05/the-pros-and-cons-of-breastfeeding-a-toddler/

(This one has some more links at the end.)

http://www.accidentalpharmacist.com/2010/12/extending-breastfeeding-beyond-year.html

(This one has a lot of good links at the end as well.)

http://healthland.time.com/2010/12/20/want-smarter-kids-consider-breastfeeding/?xid=rss-topstories&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+time/topstories+(TIME:+Top+Stories)

And just for fun, here's a video that went around during National Breastfeeding Week, and is what my title references.